I am very excited to announce that pre-orders for A Modern Anarchism are now available on the @pmpress website!
pmpress.org/index.php?l=producβ¦
This edition differs slightly from the previously published versions of the text. In this version I have elaborated on some of the core topics of the essay, especially in parts 1 and 3. I have also reorganized some of the information to make it more palatable as one complete piece.
Solidarity forever in the struggle against the kyriarchal mega-machine.
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RockBottom
in reply to F_State • • •F_State
in reply to RockBottom • • •theparadox
in reply to F_State • • •The vanguard is not a different group. The vanguard is the part of the group that ends up doing something first.
It's not separate from the group, and it's often not even distinguished from the group in any way aside from the fact that it was motivated enough to act first.
Aljernon
in reply to theparadox • • •theparadox
in reply to Aljernon • • •No, it's not. It's like saying that the leaders and organizers within the working class will lead the working class and ensure that the means of production are managed after they are seized. Someone (an individual or a group) has to do it, and they should know what they are doing.
The person I responded to said "a different group". My point is that it's a subset of the larger group. Yes, it's possible to take advantage of the situation and try to grab power afterward. If that subset seized it to enrich themselves, they are class traitors - they are of the working class but betrayed them. However, some person or group needs to literally lead and manage, usually democratically. It can't be literally the entirety of the working class.
All of this is just twisting terms and concepts to try to sow distrust in communist or socialist theory, assuming there will always be some secret group of elites scheming to take everything for themselves the moment the means are seized.
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βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to F_State • • •F_State
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to F_State • • •Deceptichum
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to Deceptichum • • •if push come to shove the working class always has the power to overthrow the vanguard. yet large populations are generally to stupid to do so due to all the propaganda and reeducation (see the USA currently). first one would need to remove capitalism from the equation, and create political education that is systemically impossible to manipulate or censor. after that the working class will gain consciousness over time.
Cowbee [he/they]
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •This is wrong on two levels.
The first is in separating the vanguard from the working classes. The vanguard is a subsection of the working classes chosen by the rest of the working classes. Vanguards derive their power from the bottom-up.
The second is in assuming the working classes are stupid and easily duped. People instead license themselves to believe what they think benefits them is good. Socialist systems have always focused on education and literacy programs because a society run by the working classes works better with more informed members, but even within capitalism workers still come to understand the necessary conditions for their own liberation simply by existing within the brutally oppressive systems.
βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to Cowbee [he/they] • • •i dont think it is that wrong to seperate those 2. one could argue that by having different power than the rest all (regardless of where its coming from), it again becomes its own class.
and yes people realise themselves that capitalism is a horrendous system, yet they dont realise it enough to unite. if it was that easy to realise, we wouldnt have racism and such anymore and would have already liberated the working class. yet the class as a whole remains ignorant even if individual groups see through it all. im not saying the working class as a whole is stupid because it cant get smarter, im saying it is intentionally kept stupid and divided, and to stop that we first need to rid ourselves of the system thats responsible for that.
Cowbee [he/they]
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •If you separate class from its basis in relation to the mode of production, then you are pivoting from Marxism. Class is not about "power," it's about social relations to the mode of production and how we fit into that. Plumbers and factory workers are both proletarian despite having different jobs, the same applies to administrators and managers.
Secondly, history is not a series of snapshots but instead a dialectical process. We should help accelerate class consciousness, and tackle bourgeois cultural hegemony, but we are not outside the class struggle and instead are within it.
Deceptichum
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to Deceptichum • • •Deceptichum
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to Deceptichum • • •Deceptichum
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to Deceptichum • • •i feel like a contrarian how much i gotta disagree in this thread.
i think it is valid to mention that one is deviating from a theory.
and i think its valid to disagree with that deviation.
Deceptichum
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •And you're going to unite the working class by demanding others can't voice their opinion if it goes against the red bible?
Because that's what they are doing when they enforce purity of thought.
βSaltyIceteaβ
in reply to Deceptichum • • •Aljernon
in reply to Cowbee [he/they] • • •The Vanguard chose themselves and if you don't like it, straight to Lubyanka
Cowbee [he/they]
in reply to Aljernon • • •Deceptichum
in reply to βSaltyIceteaβ • • •That is true, but it's a huge undertaking to do even once, let alone twice in 'rapid' (10-30 years) succession once it turns out the vanguards have become the oldguards.
Systemic change need to happen naturally from a grass-roots level if it is to truly last as an alternative to the status quo. It needs to be something that all people feel heard and supported in, and want to see succeed.
This is one of the beauties of anarchism in that it promotes local groups to flourish, and to make the changes they need to suitable for their needs and environs. You can start working on secondary support systems without needing to wait for the revolution.
novibe
in reply to F_State • • •There’s a weird misunderstanding of what a “vanguard” is, in both left anti-communist and communist circles.
A vanguard is not a self-defined group that rules over the proles and directs them towards a revolution and governs once it’s won.
Vanguards are not things that exist in the present. Vanguard is just a term to help understand a revolution after it happens.
When a revolution happens, the most politically advanced (in class consciousness and left theory) individuals and groups that participate will steer the people towards socialism. They will lead, by example, on who to fight, how and why.
During the revolution, they aren’t called anything and specially not by themselves.
But after the revolution, when analyzing it, those people are then called the vanguard of the revolution.
Any communist that says they want to “form and participate in a vanguard party” has no understanding of revolutions and left theory.
Any left anti-communist that derides vanguards for being authoritarian and “repli
... Show more...Thereβs a weird misunderstanding of what a βvanguardβ is, in both left anti-communist and communist circles.
A vanguard is not a self-defined group that rules over the proles and directs them towards a revolution and governs once itβs won.
Vanguards are not things that exist in the present. Vanguard is just a term to help understand a revolution after it happens.
When a revolution happens, the most politically advanced (in class consciousness and left theory) individuals and groups that participate will steer the people towards socialism. They will lead, by example, on who to fight, how and why.
During the revolution, they arenβt called anything and specially not by themselves.
But after the revolution, when analyzing it, those people are then called the vanguard of the revolution.
Any communist that says they want to βform and participate in a vanguard partyβ has no understanding of revolutions and left theory.
Any left anti-communist that derides vanguards for being authoritarian and βreplicating state oppressionβ also have no understanding of revolutions or left theory.
Honestly we would all be better off just not using the term vanguard at all anymore.
Bababasti
in reply to novibe • • •You know, you can be anti-authoritarian and still be a communist. Anarcho-Communism is a real thing.
novibe
in reply to Bababasti • • •dogbert
in reply to novibe • • •novibe
in reply to dogbert • • •This comes from the unfortunate viral idea that communism has stages.
Some people get really attached to this idea, and either become super against it or super for it. Then they end up wanting to either fully concentrate on “lower stage communism” and idolize militaristic aesthetics of early communist revolutions, and the perceived “toughness” and “authoritarianism” they had. In the extreme this becomes shit like the ACP.
On the other hand, others completely forgo any large scale timeline thinking, and start fantasizing and theorizing about a possible quick jump to “stateless, classless, moneyless” society (which is in itself a misinterpretation of what communism is but that’s another thing completely) in a single revolutionary moment and process.
There are no stages, communism is not total anarchy either. Communism is the means and methods the working class uses to abolish itself. This should start with a revolution, and continue until it’s finished. This process likely would take many generations. And
... Show more...This comes from the unfortunate viral idea that communism has stages.
Some people get really attached to this idea, and either become super against it or super for it. Then they end up wanting to either fully concentrate on βlower stage communismβ and idolize militaristic aesthetics of early communist revolutions, and the perceived βtoughnessβ and βauthoritarianismβ they had. In the extreme this becomes shit like the ACP.
On the other hand, others completely forgo any large scale timeline thinking, and start fantasizing and theorizing about a possible quick jump to βstateless, classless, moneylessβ society (which is in itself a misinterpretation of what communism is but thatβs another thing completely) in a single revolutionary moment and process.
There are no stages, communism is not total anarchy either. Communism is the means and methods the working class uses to abolish itself. This should start with a revolution, and continue until itβs finished. This process likely would take many generations. And it would be one continuous revolution. This is communism, this state of affairs. Of the long revolution of self-abolishment of the working class.
What comes AFTER, is a stateless classless moneyless society. What is dissolved first and when depends on the revolution, but it wouldnβt all be at once, or it would. Who knows.
Aljernon
in reply to Bababasti • • •flora_explora
in reply to novibe • • •novibe
in reply to flora_explora • • •That doesnβt happen though. What we saw were rightwing counterrevolutionaries taking over the USSR, China etc.
But historically itβs a great mischaracterization of all socialist revolutions to say they were βovertaken by authoritariansβ.
All revolutions are βauthoritarianβ.
SpookyBogMonster
in reply to flora_explora • • •socialist current
Contributors to Wikimedia projects (Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.)lmmarsano
in reply to novibe • • •So, did Soviets get the concept wrong?
It's often claimed dictatorship of the proletariat doesn't mean an actual dictator, yet there it was.
What do we call the Soviet concept of vanguard if not vanguardism?
AnyOldName3
in reply to lmmarsano • • •ThunderQueen
in reply to novibe • • •novibe
in reply to ThunderQueen • • •Idk man I think thereβs as many people like that as βanarchistsβ who live under bridges and dump dive.
Itβs just that libs and left anti-communists usually see any type of real actual action and revolutionary practice as βevilβ.
Cowbee [he/they]
in reply to F_State • • •The vanguard is just the formalized and democratized segment of the most trained professional revolutionaries in the working classes. It isn't distinct from the working class, that's like saying electricians are different from the working class. The vanguard is formalized and democratized so as to be accountable and transparent, and doesn't "rule over" the working classes but is the representative body chosen by the working classes. The vanguard doesn't sieze the means of production, the working class does, led by the vanguard they have chosen.
The working class is a spear. The vanguard is the spearhead, and the rest of the working class forms the actual mass that drives the spearhead through the capitalist machine. A spear with no spearhead isn't very effective, a spearhead without a base even less so. Together, though, they form an effective revolutionary force that can kill the most violent fascist machines.
Pulptastic
in reply to Cowbee [he/they] • • •Cowbee [he/they]
in reply to Pulptastic • • •dogbert
in reply to F_State • • •Cowbee [he/they]
in reply to dogbert • • •GrammarPolice
in reply to dogbert • • •Deceptichum
in reply to dogbert • • •Aljernon
in reply to Deceptichum • • •SpookyBogMonster
in reply to F_State • • •This assumes that a vanguard is a separate class, when what it really is, is an advanced segment of the working class. That said, I wanna inject some good faith complexity here.
A Maoist critique of a a vanguard would assert that, by being the most advanced segment of the working class, a petty bourgeois element can exist within a party.
In the maoist view, since class struggle persists under socialism, that petty bourgeois element can, wittingly or otherwise, lead the socialist state back to capitalism. And as such, this needs to be struggled against.
The solution to this isn't to discard the concept of a vanguard, after all most socialist revolutions, which have seized power, have featured them.
Rather, Maoism has the concept of The Mass Line, wherein the party seeks to intimately involve itself with the masses. And the Cultural Revolution, where the class conscious masses are unleashed on the party itself, to keep it in check. Hence the Cultural Revolution slogans like, "its right to rebel" and "Bombard the headquarters"
I'm not a Maoist (I find th
... Show more...This assumes that a vanguard is a separate class, when what it really is, is an advanced segment of the working class. That said, I wanna inject some good faith complexity here.
A Maoist critique of a a vanguard would assert that, by being the most advanced segment of the working class, a petty bourgeois element can exist within a party.
In the maoist view, since class struggle persists under socialism, that petty bourgeois element can, wittingly or otherwise, lead the socialist state back to capitalism. And as such, this needs to be struggled against.
The solution to this isn't to discard the concept of a vanguard, after all most socialist revolutions, which have seized power, have featured them.
Rather, Maoism has the concept of The Mass Line, wherein the party seeks to intimately involve itself with the masses. And the Cultural Revolution, where the class conscious masses are unleashed on the party itself, to keep it in check. Hence the Cultural Revolution slogans like, "its right to rebel" and "Bombard the headquarters"
I'm not a Maoist (I find the maoist position on AES to be lacking), but it's a tradition I have respect for. There's this big emphasis on the dialectic between top-down and bottom-up power that's really worth exploring, I think. I once heard it jokingly called "Anarcho-stalinism" and I hope you can see why lol
ozymandias
in reply to F_State • • •and of course i need to mention that the USSR was only communist in name and are nearly the worst possible example of communismβ¦.
Elmer Fud strikes again
ThunderQueen
in reply to ozymandias • • •