My theory about black holes 😀
Shut’up. I know, ‘am no physicist. And no scientist for that matter. That’s fine. I just had an idea and is likely to be wrong but it makes my brain giggle with curiosity.
Read the post. I just solved the black holes and dark matter mystery. hahaha #tromlive
https://www.tiotrom.com/2021/11/my-theory-about-black-holes/
My theory about black holes :)
Shut'up. I know, 'am no physicist. And no scientist for that matter. That's fine. I just had an idea and is likely to be wrong but it makes my brain giggle with curiosity.TIO
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •How does this dark matter singularity become that foggy patches shown in the NASA Hubble map ? To me, this doesn't seem to solve dark matter but just complicates things even more, lol 😂
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Tio
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in reply to Rokosun • • •Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Singularity is more like a point, so calling it a "ball" is kinda misleading. Also, there's a lot of unknowns about dark matter, you're just making a lot of assumptions here, that stars convert matter to dark matter when they explode, that black holes convert matter to dark matter when it swallows something, etc. There's no need to make it this complicated when you can explain everything using a singularity made of normal matter, not dark.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •I did make some assumptions is correct but won't say a lot of them. I assumed that black holes are made out of dark matter, something that it is actually studied and theorized. I mean the relationship between dark matter and black holes. The other assumption was that matter can transform into dark matter, something that @David Sugar sent a paper about which seems to suggest such a theory :P.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I don't know man, they're just super weird. I think the singularity idea was proposed because its gravitational pull is so strong that it pulls light and swallows it, I don't think a star can do that.
My understanding about black holes are pretty basic & I haven't read any of these proposed theories. I think the singularity idea & the general theory of relativity are more widely accepted, IDK.
@tychosoft
Tio
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Rokosun
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Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •@tychosoft
Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •You're right, these might be a bit "bla bla bla", its still quite interesting to think about. They really show us our limitations, we can't know the answer to everything.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I don't know if there's any reason to be against the field of philosophy, that Vsause video I sent you earlier is pretty philosophical, but I can't say I never learned anything from it :)
@tychosoft
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •@tychosoft
Tio
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Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •"It just pulls everything in to the singularity" - so you're saying it pulls stuff into that "point"? Then why are these black holes bigger, smaller, have a shape, a mass? I don't get it :D
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I'm no expert, but from what I understand, what they mean by the size is the event horizon. The event horizon is a boundary inside which light can no longer escape. So intuitively, this event horizon should expand when the mass increases because gravity increases with mass.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •hmm isnt the event horizon the boundary between that dark circle (what i call as the black ball) and the visible matter? Something like this_
And the entire black disk is that "singularity"? Maybe I am confused....
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Its really interesting cause there's a lot we don't know about black holes, maybe the truth is even more weirder than our theories, haha.
Tio
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Rokosun
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Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Most black holes I've seen in pictures and stuff have a spherical event horizon, and I think the disk you're mentioning is things orbiting these black holes that glow because of their heat, that video explained it. If the event horizon is spherical, the stuff inside should be spherical too right ? I don't know enough about gravitational fields to know
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Sounds right to me but how can we know :D. If I think about my black ball theory then yes haha.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Could be, but the mass of the black hole still has to exist somewhere inside the event horizon. The idea of a singularity is probably used to explain the extreme gravitational pull, maybe it'll have less space-time curvature if the mass is spread around VS on a densely packed point. So more space-time curvature means more gravity. I'm still not sure how scientifically proven this singularity thing is, this is my understanding.
Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •> this mass of a black hole is not that black disk we observe, but a tiny point in the middle.
Of course, the event horizon is not a physical boundary like the boundary of a ball, its a point after which light can no longer escape from the gravity of the black hole. And gravitational field is always much larger than the size of the object, think about sun pulling on earth.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Same for a black hole, it extends far more than that dark disk (ball).
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I don't know if its just a theory, what's happening inside a black hole we can't know, but we can observe the surroundings to prove that there's extreme gravity there that even light can't escape. Remember, light only moves in a straight line, but massive objects can bend the space-time curvature to bend its path. This has been proven, I recommend you look more into general theory of relativity, its very interesting :)
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I've been thinking about this video you sent me....... And I think I get it now, I understand why they theorized singularity to be a point. This is even more stranger & weirder than I thought, haha.
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Its really hard for me to grasp this concept, because its so different from everything I've experienced in my life. My intuition tells me that if more stuff gets sucked into the black hole, the singularity should get bigger. But it doesn't !
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Maybe it does....
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio
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Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I still have some doubts as to what happens after it turns into dark matter, but considering how little we know about them I don't think there's any point in us arguing over what "might" be happening, lol 😅
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •https://ytb.trom.tf/watch?v=poE8CuucCEg
https://ytb.trom.tf/embed/0sr1Xeocuuc
Although I will have to update my theory ( :)) ) it still may be wrong the way they are theorizing about it now. Maybe there's still a black ball instead of a black hole, and it is made of a different type of matter, maybe even dark matter.
You did great at explaining this, and I am very happy you have engaged in such a discussion :).
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •My confusion regarding this black balls theory is this:
1. Not even light can escape a black hole because its so dense that the gravity is in the extremes. But if it was a ball the same size (of event horizon), then it wouldn't be this dense and wouldn't have that much gravity
2. We don't even know if matter can become dark matter, let alone say that stars exploding will cause it. Its called dark matter cause we literally know nothing about it, lol 😂
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Tio likes this.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Exactly. We don't even know if it is matter. But has similar properties with a black hole that's why they are thinking black matter can in fact be black holes. They both do not interact with light/matter so that we can't see them, and have a strong gravitational pull.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I didn't knew about that, interesting... 🤔
Also, keep in mind that this mathematician can be wrong, there has to be a reason we don't call it a star anymore. Einstein published general relativity in 1915, before that we didn't had a clear picture of how gravity worked.
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Also, when you call it a black ball, a dark planet comes to my mind. And I don't get how a planet can do what a black hole does. Even if your black ball was made of dark matter, the gravitational properties would be kinda the same as a normal ball.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •A star doesn't have to glow. White dwarfs barely glow.
Take normal matter. A neutron star then the Venus planet. Both made out of normal matter. But the neutron star's gravitational pull is immense compared to the one of the planet Venus. Despite them being made out of the same matter. Why can't it be that dark matter that we observe scattered around the universe clump under tremendous pressures into a ball just like a neutron star, and have immense gravitational pull? :P
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •From wikipedia: "A star is an astronomical object consisting of a luminous spheroid of plasma held together by its own gravity"
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •If scientists are looking into such theories, then they're probably doing it for entirely different reasons than us 😂
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Why would you invent the singularity (infinite point), or the "event horizon"? These are completely new things. To say that the blackness of a black hole is just stuff that we can't see because light can't escape the gravitational pull, is also an invention, isn't it?
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I don't understand this point, that's why I asked this question:
> How does this dark matter singularity become that foggy patches shown in the NASA Hubble map ?
The gravity of a black hole is so strong that nothing can escape it, so how can dark matter escape it considering their gravitational properties are similar to normal matter ?
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •I don't think its an invention, that's how we define black holes !
(AFAIK, We defined them even before finding one IRL)
From Wikipedia: "A black hole is a region of spacetime where gravity is so strong that nothing — no particles or even electromagnetic radiation such as light — can escape from it."
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •I was reading through the history of black holes and from what I got from it, at first it was theorized that there can be dark stars, as I said in other comments. So dense that light can't escape them.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Now the same matter can form a cloud of gas that has a very weak gravitational pull, or under tremendous pressures a more dense object like a planet or a star, or a neutron star.
So, same matter, different "objects": from clouds of gas, to planets, asteroids, or stars of wildly different sizes and densities.
Why can't this be true for dark matter? What if dark matter is made out of different particles (atoms) and in most cases you see it as a sort of "gas" that still has a decent gravitational pull from my understanding, but at times under tremendous pressures it coalesces in the form of a star.
ofc this is pure speculation but an interesting thought experiment.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Ofc, this is a possibility, I understand that. But my point here is that it can't go from a planet to a gas, only the other way around. So if you're saying all dark matter are created when black holes are born, be it a black ball/star, it'll never become that foggy patches shown in the NASA Hubble map.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Also I find it bizarre that this super strange "point" (singularity) has a magnetic field like all stars have. As far as I understand it. It makes more sense for it to have a magnetic filed if it is a dark ball in my mind at least.
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Ok, this is actually what I wanted to hear, now your theory is making more sense to me, and I understand it better now 😀
I just couldn't think of any way its mass could spread out, haha 😂
So the answer is a supernova explosion that spreads out the mass of these black balls that are made of dark matter.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •Yes, and that's what makes black holes interesting, they are wild 😀
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •One thing we both agree here is that our knowledge about the universe is limited. I'm not saying your theory can't be true, I'm just trying to explain why I find it confusing. Ofc, we have different POV about black holes 🙂
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •> They had to invent a new kind of physics to explain those new particles.
New physics ? Dude, quantum mechanics is literally MAGIC !
Did you know that they actually teleported data using quantum entanglement ? If this isn't magic, IDK what is......
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yb38jozeDOs
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun likes this.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •BTW, you can try doing the double slit experiment at home - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKdaRJ3vAmA
I'll do this one day when I buy a laser, a cheap one should be enough I think.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun likes this.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I think of singularity as a point, its more exciting for me that way ;)
And considering how little we know about the universe, maybe the closest we can get to truth is to consider the latest science we know. Ofc, it can always be wrong, but that's just the best we can know from a scientific perspective 🙂
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •This is actually an interesting question. I think technically they're kinda the same, but we gave them different names just to make communication easier for us.
Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio
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Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •So considering scientists say that we have almost no clue about what black holes really are, or what dark matter/energy are, then maybe they can be totally wrong. That makes me even more excited :)
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Tio
in reply to Tio • •Rokosun likes this.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Funny story, I've heard this argument from a religious person, saying that science will say one thing today and another thing tomorrow, so its not reliable. I later said to him that where there's change there's progress, so science will keep correcting its mistakes and become better as time goes on, while religion is stuck in the past 🙂
Tio
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Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I think your way of looking at it might me more accurate. Its not time slowing down, its just rate of change of atoms or something that changes, that's usually what we mean when we say time slows down.
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Tio
Unknown parent • •Tio
in reply to Tio • •Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •I wonder if its a bug in friendica or you just accidentally clicking the wrong reply button, this seems to happen from time to time. I don't know how it is in friendica, but if its a bug they gotta fix it soon.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Liwott
in reply to Tio • • •- beyond their Event Horizon (EH), Black Holes (BH) are composed of Dark Matter (DM)
- DM is composed differently from ordinary matter
- ordinary matter is converted into DM when crossing the EH
- BH sometimes release DM, that's the DM we need to explain stuff
Is there any other claim that I missed?What is the problem that these assumptions may facilitate solving? How can (3) and (4) be implemented in practice?
Tio
in reply to Liwott • •Liwott
in reply to Tio • • •When you say that "there is no event horizon", do you mean that ... ?
Tio
in reply to Liwott • •As for your points I'd simply say what I said in the article. Gravity, from my understanding, is not very well understood nowadays. Maybe black matter is so heavy that's why it attracts matter into it and we think that's a black hole.
Liwott
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Roma
in reply to Tio • •https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLpfOUIFYuw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuWvJXZT5vQ
This one is about the other objects in space:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLoLey75i2k
They even have one where you can imagine you are diving into a blackhole and what you perhaps can see (except being ripped apart immediately or "spaghettified" as serious scietists call it :D), again, according to the latest scientific theories and models are known to date (mind blowing!!!):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rTv9wvvat8s
Here you can do that youselves in 360:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17tEg_uTF_A
All in all, I recommenend that entire channel to watch, so you can take a grasp of very complex notions like space mechanics or quantum mechanics in a very digestable way: https://www.youtube.com/c/ScienceClicEN/videos
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Tio
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Roma
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Tio
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Roma
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