Tested Matrix on our trom.tf and very likely we will also provide that. A Matrix server and client, so anyone can register and use a client. Matrix is an awesome protocol so having an account on the network opens up a lot of possibilities. You will be able to connect with so many communities. And I seriously think to move back to Matrix with our TROM Chats that are now handled by Nextcloud Talk. There are many Matrix clients, so basically one can register with our trom.tf and have their account there, but then use any client they want to chat with their friends. I used Riot for many years back when it just came into existence and I started to hate it when the main instance and client were pushing trades into my face, like "why dont you move to our better server for $$ a month"... But now that we will have our own trade-free server we could move our discussions there.
So I tested it and so far so great + I customized it a bit and all that. I will have to check its integration with Signal and Whatsapp to see if it really works well.
But yah, another service for trom.tf. I don't just add tons of apps there, I only add those that are unique and super useful. Matrix is one of them for sure. #tromlive
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio likes this.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •I've read the article. A good one. But I feel like if we really want a decentralized messenger we should go directly for p2p and there are a few such alternatives. I even made an article about it a year or so ago tromjaro.com/communicate-trade… . There are ups and downs for these p2p ones tho.
I'd like a messenger that can: support group chats, sending files, video/audio calls between people or groups of people, maybe have clients for all operating systems....
From my tests qTox and Jami are the best right now. They are reliable and work great. And so easy to deal with them. Just install them and create an account locally. That's all. Even video/audio calls work + desktop sharing. They seem like a perfect alternative to say Matrix-like chats. But they fall short if you want to have multiple clients on multiple devices for the same account. Difficult to setup at times, and messages do not sync properly - you either get the messages on one or another device, but not on both from my tests....
like this
Rokosun and LPS like this.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •When we last spoke about p2p apps, I told you that I'd be giving briar another try. Well, I did that a few days ago and saw some new features got added - support of sending images, profile pictures, and disappearing messages.
Note that briar is not as feature rich as jami/tox cause its mainly focused on freedom of speech. That's why briar routes traffic through Tor by default, and supports wifi/Bluetooth. Some often overlooked but important features of briar are the forum and blog support.
Tio likes this.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun likes this.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •No, I agree with you. Briar is mainly focused on higher threat models like activities and journalists, so I don't think it'll be a good option for normal people. But I wanted to talk about it regardless, because its important that we have a more robust way to communicate in case something goes wrong. Briar would even work without an internet connection, keeping the information flowing in a crisis.
I am keeping an eye on p2p technologies, all of them. Let's see how these apps develop 😀
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •From my experience with briar and atox in the past, I've noticed that my android was killing its background connection. I couldn't fix this problem no matter what I did. I know this is a problem of android OS and the app itself is not to blame. But sadly this is not a rare situation on android - dontkillmyapp.com/
I have a device that runs lineageOS which don't seem to have this problem, but sadly most people's phones are running proprietary tradeful OSes that kills apps.
LPS
in reply to Rokosun • • •@tio
Tio likes this.
Rokosun
in reply to Rokosun • • •You can write blogs on briar. And anyone can reblog the things you write and comment on them if they like. This would make it more that just a messenger, but a secure and censorship-free way to communicate and share around information. And here's the coolest thing - you can subscribe to a public blog outside of briar by importing its rss feed !
You can do everything on these imported RSS blogs as well - reblog them, comment on them, anything you want !
Tio likes this.
Tio
in reply to Rokosun • •Rokosun likes this.
Rokosun
in reply to Tio • • •Tio likes this.
Tio
Unknown parent • •Tio
Unknown parent • •Not that great really. That's the biggest downside. I tested qTox and Jami a lot. They are really great if you only use them on desktop with Linux, else they are not that great.
As for CO2 footprint this is the first time I see someone wonder about it and while I think it is good to think about that, there are other systems in our society that are far more polluting that the digital world, so I'd be surprised if such small examples like a messenger's footprint have any real impact when it comes to CO2 emissions. Think transportation, livestock, and production of stuff in general....
But even if you consider the CO2 impact, isn't it less if we use p2p chats? I am already keeping my computer on for other things, so that might as well function as a node and send + receive data (messages and such). Else we need a 3rd party, a server that does all of these.
In other words, for me to use Element (matrix client), I need a server (a computer that's on all the time to receive and send my messages) + my computer t
... Show more...Not that great really. That's the biggest downside. I tested qTox and Jami a lot. They are really great if you only use them on desktop with Linux, else they are not that great.
As for CO2 footprint this is the first time I see someone wonder about it and while I think it is good to think about that, there are other systems in our society that are far more polluting that the digital world, so I'd be surprised if such small examples like a messenger's footprint have any real impact when it comes to CO2 emissions. Think transportation, livestock, and production of stuff in general....
But even if you consider the CO2 impact, isn't it less if we use p2p chats? I am already keeping my computer on for other things, so that might as well function as a node and send + receive data (messages and such). Else we need a 3rd party, a server that does all of these.
In other words, for me to use Element (matrix client), I need a server (a computer that's on all the time to receive and send my messages) + my computer that needs to be on in order to interact with element of course. But if I use Jami for example, I need no server. Just my computer.
Alien (A23P)
in reply to Tio • • •The "S" in "IoT" stands for "Security"
There's an underlying Moral/Ethic issue to resolve
dominant modes of modern "energy exchange" of all kinds are generally in a state of FUBAR (F'd Up Beyond All Recognition) barring that. There's prolific chip set issues, underlying protocol issues, device addressing issues, it just goes on and on. When the sum is pitted against a "powerful adversary", and rest assured "Powerful Adversary" exist, about the only secure means is to totally drop virtually all modern net and IT usage..... go total luddite.
XMPP doesn't facilitate groups chats, video, voice over ip.....
... Show more...I see MATRIX as more like a vid/voice phone protocol meets IRC.
Could it be better? Sure.
Does it offer some better implementations and/or capabilities than things like Google Duo, Zoom, Facebook Messenger, Signal, Telegram, etc.? Sure.
Generally speaking is it capable of functioning to meet a security threat level of "things aren't going to be brought and used against you in court"? Sure.
Is it ultimately "IoT"? Yes.... and the "IoT" itself is FU
The "S" in "IoT" stands for "Security"
There's an underlying Moral/Ethic issue to resolve
dominant modes of modern "energy exchange" of all kinds are generally in a state of FUBAR (F'd Up Beyond All Recognition) barring that. There's prolific chip set issues, underlying protocol issues, device addressing issues, it just goes on and on. When the sum is pitted against a "powerful adversary", and rest assured "Powerful Adversary" exist, about the only secure means is to totally drop virtually all modern net and IT usage..... go total luddite.
XMPP doesn't facilitate groups chats, video, voice over ip.....
I see MATRIX as more like a vid/voice phone protocol meets IRC.
Could it be better? Sure.
Does it offer some better implementations and/or capabilities than things like Google Duo, Zoom, Facebook Messenger, Signal, Telegram, etc.? Sure.
Generally speaking is it capable of functioning to meet a security threat level of "things aren't going to be brought and used against you in court"? Sure.
Is it ultimately "IoT"? Yes.... and the "IoT" itself is FUBAR
Because the IoT is FUBAR, there's really no running around to a secure and safe area....
generally speaking, one's bound to find that soon as they ran all they'd ran to was SNAFU (Situation Normal; All F'd Up). That's just as applicable to the Federation itself.
Not Safe For Work Friendica Admin likes this.
Alien (A23P)
in reply to Tio • • •@Ingo Jürgensmann
That's really GREAT to know and hear! Cheers!
Seems it was more so something that passed me by and I'd just never bothered using it with my (more direct) XMPP clients (but had otherwise used it through other means for years as it would turn out)....
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jingle_(…
Granted, as prior noted, the "IoT" itself is just FUBAR
and it's not like one is doing all that much better than Israeli Intelligence connected workings by swapping out to things G-Men born. All the same Enterprise club really.
Side note on things Jami, while I use Jami myself and find it fine enough for a number of things, more than consistency issues (have continually had a lot of video/voice drops), among the negatives I personally feel
... Show more...@Ingo Jürgensmann
That's really GREAT to know and hear! Cheers!
Seems it was more so something that passed me by and I'd just never bothered using it with my (more direct) XMPP clients (but had otherwise used it through other means for years as it would turn out)....
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jingle_(…
Granted, as prior noted, the "IoT" itself is just FUBAR
and it's not like one is doing all that much better than Israeli Intelligence connected workings by swapping out to things G-Men born. All the same Enterprise club really.
Side note on things Jami, while I use Jami myself and find it fine enough for a number of things, more than consistency issues (have continually had a lot of video/voice drops), among the negatives I personally feel with it is it's catering to blockchain.
jami.net/the-jami-blockchain-s…
Yes, it's just the user naming convention, but none the less, the issues with blockchain that come up are too numerous to enumerate and getting in bed with Ethereum (Enterprise Alliance), is basically the same as jumping in bed with Israeli intelligence, the G-Men, etc. Ultimately, it all roots back to the same Enterprise (even if increasingly publicly obfuscated) born guided and supported efforts that are coupled to existent "Powerful Adversary" issues.
Basically, underlying collectively emergent root Moral/Ethic issues, which really aren't something that can be simply "coded" or otherwise "techied" away, remain.
As the old saying goes, "No matter where you go, there you are".