We're happy to announce a long-term partnership with Motorola. We're collaborating on future devices meeting our privacy and security standards with official GrapheneOS support.
Lots of these are giving up even more security features.
> hardened_malloc, malloc-ng, or mimalloc-secure
These aren't the same classes of allocators at all. Neither the musl malloc or mimalloc is a hardened allocator. mimalloc is performance focused and musl's is focused on low memory usage.
> What are your thoughts on what to do in case the day comes that Google kills AOSP?
What about when IBM decides to kill systemd, GCC and GNOME?
@lumi @alexia The current default software stack for desktop Linux is kind of terrible and the lack of coherent threat model or proper ecosystem of sandboxed applications are major issues with desktop right now. What I am still questioning is whether it is even possible to make a proper competitor to ChromeOS (if we ignore the hardware insecurity of basically all PCs).
So example software choices: systemd -> dinit or s6 sudo -> s6-sudo (setuidless) glibc -> muslc glibc malloc or jemalloc -> hardened_malloc, malloc-ng, or mimalloc-secure (which supports more CPU architectures) bubblewrap (sandbox used by Flatpak) -> #syd (it's written in Rust, has many important exploit protections, and can even be the user login: g
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@lumi @alexia The current default software stack for desktop Linux is kind of terrible and the lack of coherent threat model or proper ecosystem of sandboxed applications are major issues with desktop right now. What I am still questioning is whether it is even possible to make a proper competitor to ChromeOS (if we ignore the hardware insecurity of basically all PCs).
So example software choices: systemd -> dinit or s6 sudo -> s6-sudo (setuidless) glibc -> muslc glibc malloc or jemalloc -> hardened_malloc, malloc-ng, or mimalloc-secure (which supports more CPU architectures) bubblewrap (sandbox used by Flatpak) -> #syd (it's written in Rust, has many important exploit protections, and can even be the user login: gitlab.exherbo.org/sydbox/sydb…) GNOME or KDE -> XFCE (when their new Rust Wayland native WM is finished) gnutils -> *BSD or uutils
The issue of course with most of these alternatives is that they are separate projects and therefore dont have the same goals, methods, or threat models. Also most of these projects are written in C which does not help at all. Also there is of course the lack of a proper chain of trust from the hardware to loading the kernel and userspace.
It may just not be reasonably possible to provide a alternative without millions of dollars of funding and a decade of development. It would be nice for there to be an alternative to AOSP/ChromeOS or even MacOS for desktop computing which actually takes security seriously. It doesnt even need to have be completely on par when it comes to security, just do better than current Linux distros (not a very high bar).
What are your thoughts on what to do in case the day comes that Google kills AOSP?
@GOKUSHRM Our partnership is Motorola is not exclusive and we're fully allowed to partner with other OEMs. However, we don't currently have the resources to partner with additional OEMs and it will likely be a while before we do.
Partnerning to make smartphones with a company which recently discontinued their smartphones doesn't sound workable. The point is also mainly getting an OEM to raise their security to meet our requirements rather than getting an OEM to sell devices with GrapheneOS.
@GOKUSHRM We're not going to lower our standards to expand device support so if they can't or won't meet the requirements then there's not much to talk about. That's why most of the smaller OEMs are ruled out because they can't afford or are at least unwilling to invest in the required security including long term updates and a high end SoC. The device itself doesn't have to be high end as a whole but the SoC needs to be high end to get long term support and the current era security features.
@GOKUSHRM SoC licensing is very expensive especially for the latest and greatest. No one really wants to use a flagship SoC in anything but a flagship device.
doing PGO on a development build (considering the guide is meant for developers) is insane IMO
that's something one would do on their final fully optimized build, not for development, and specially not if the need to debug anything in native code is there...
from what i recall in my encounters with googlers: it's pgo.
from my own experience on gentoo lto adds around 30% memory pressure and pgo adds around 50%, compile time is mostly unaffected with lto but pgo quadruples it.
meaning you could run with less memory, by reducing the amount of parallel builds, except that would make the already long 6 hour build time increase close to exponentially
This entry was edited (Tuesday, March 3, 2026, 11:15 AM)
It has a package manager and has out-of-band updates to the APEX and APK components along with separate updates for boot, vendor and system images. Most of the core userspace OS is in APEX modules now.
also keep in mind each compile thread uses memory. blender rn uses like 30 gb to compile because i'm giving it 24 threads, especially when it comes to the render kernels bit since it's a single giant file.
It's the number of logical cores which determine the number of jobs by default. In general, Android builds should have 2GB per logical core unless the number of jobs is lowered.
note that, as i mentioned on the thread before, back in 2019 i tried to build it on a 7th gen i7 (so 4/8 c/t) with 16 gigs of ram and a sata ssd, after 3 days of non-stop building, i gave up
and that was when the minimum recommendations were still 32gb of ram
@rogueren @1a5cff5118d071a2c5d46534733abb9f3dcdfc41b24db0132fc20dbf01c75f78 A large portion of the GrapheneOS hardening is device specific and having device specific builds is inherently more secure due to lower attack surface and being able to specialize the builds with features like RANDSTRUCT for each device model. Aside from that, most of their devices aren't going to be able to meet our requirements. It will initially be several flagships meeting our requirements and then more over time.
@1a5cff5118d071a2c5d46534733abb9f3dcdfc41b24db0132fc20dbf01c75f78 it'll almost certainly be specific devices just due to how ARM chips work. Every chipset needs its own special drivers, which means you can't make a universal version to run on most devices. On top of Graphene being very strict on hardware feature requirement, which was part of why Pixels were the only supported phones until now
Currently things are fine with Android but Goigle keep moving toward making Android more locked from software and apps. Is not this going to be a problem to what we have now? or there is a workaround?
Looking forward to seeing where this partnership takes the project. It's been great watching continued support of the Pixel line of phones, so throwing in an official partner organization is exciting.
I don't care if it's shit, I don't care if it's 1500€, I'm getting one. Ideally more than one if it's on the budget end. A budget Moto G at the 150€ mark with GrapheneOS would be the ultimate "if i'm under risk this is becoming a foldable".
@bill88t The initially supported ones will be expensive flagships but we do want to have budget devices eventually. It's harder to meet our update and security feature requirements for those. Look at the Motorola Signature (2026), Motorola razr ultra (2026) and Motorola razr fold (2026) for an idea of how the next gen devices will likely be. These current gen ones are way closer to our requirements than previous devices but not quite there yet.
@dalias @lumi @alexia GrapheneOS has to get huge adoption and major partnerships before we can start on our much longer term goals of moving away from using a Linux-based OS as the core operating system to a more secure platform. We want to be running the current application layer part of the OS solely via virtualization eventually. We don't expect to ever make the Linux kernel and overall model it supports on top secure enough for our goals. We'll still need the AOSP-based OS for apps.
@lumi @alexia I'm excited for GrapheneOS success for people it's for, but I fundamentally don't like the Android (AOSP, not even talking about Google) model of how basically anything works. Non-Android mobile OS options are what I want. Ones where I have full root, can run a small set of trusted apps from my distro just like I would on a laptop, and where everything else runs in an extremely restricted sandbox. I don't want those relationships inverted where a gigantic pile of Java code I could never understand or build or modify is the root of authority and I just have to trust that it's going to let me do what I want.
@lispi314 @King_of_Ooo @alexia @lumi AOSP has a far larger development community than desktop Linux. There are a huge number of both corporate and community AOSP-based projects. There's a massive community of people working on all kinds of projects related to it. Desktop Linux is assembled out of a bunch of barely maintained or developed projects with one of two developers each. It has nearly non-existent systemic work on almost anything aside from systemd gobbling up components into itself.
You'll have to explain why/how IBM owns GCC. Fairly sure it's an actual FSF project.
GNOME?
RIP lol
Other than the accessibility stuff most of it I don't care much about, and with the ensloppification going on & Red Hat apparently insisting on it, it might well die anyway.
What are your thoughts on what to do in case the day comes that Google kills AOSP?
This however has real chances of happening and already has a largely closed development process with no community.
Which means it doesn't even need a poison pill contributor agreement, all the necessary rights are probably already in Google's possession for malicious license changes.
Not to mention that the main useful part of Android, the drivers & their documentation, aren't even included anyway. Everything else could be replaced by something better with some work.
@lispi314 @King_of_Ooo @alexia @lumi systemd won not because it's good but because it actually exists as a somewhat coherent basis for an OS providing the features which are wanted. It didn't have to be a sensible or good implementation of almost anything. It's far from only an init system and the overall desktop and server ecosystems are increasing based around it. All the non-tiny desktop Linux stack ports to mobile are heavily using systemd. They're bringing systemd to mobile, not Linux.
> You know, if you're just going to avoid the question you could simply not answer that post, like you did with my mobile modem isolation question.
Don't know what you're talking about. You're one of hundreds of people.
> The overwhelming majority of the BSD tooling
It has little to do with the desktop software stack. That increasingly only has an incomplete port over to BSD with a growing amount of hacks. It would just roll it back even further.
@King_of_Ooo @alexia @lumi You know, if you're just going to avoid the question you could simply not answer that post, like you did with my mobile modem isolation question.
The overwhelming majority of the BSD tooling that isn't systemd could be ported with a modest effort if systemd died. Note that I linked daemon supervisors earlier, because session managers and init systems are a lot easier to come by.
edit: Ah, my bad, I confused the subthread. You did ignore it and replied to the prior post.
@bobkmertz @greenpete @joe9nf That was most likely the modem and in some early mobiles there was zero isolation preventing the modem from simply reading all the memory bus.
(The modem should be understood as a blackbox device at the mercy of hostile infrastructure providers & "authorities", it is attack surface.)
I would hope that such isolation is part of the GrapheneOS safety requirements.
@bobkmertz@techhub.social See grapheneos.org/faq#future-devi… for our list of requirements. Cellular modem isolation has been present on even the first device we supported (Nexus 5). It predates having proper isolation for Wi-Fi / Bluetooth.
given that Moto will have to release new devices with the support, I really hope to see something "small" - iPhone 13 Mini / SE size, for less than 1000€... One can dream.
my worry is about durability. A small debri when folding it and it's game over. I love the idea of ThinkPhone, just needs a small variant! Durable, secure and small.
If they #Motorola could add #LoRa or something similar that could be a game changer.
They would offer something that other companies don't, while there is demand from users.
It also brings privacy advantages as it makes it easier to communicate undetected from cell towers. People are starting to roll out networks covering wide areas.
In addition to that, it adds an element of resilience where people could continue to communicate even when cell towers are shut down. This is especially important during national disasters and governments overreach shutting down internet access.
Whether they'll be sold at retail with GrapheneOS preinstalled as an option isn't a question we can answer yet. It mostly comes down to Google's requirements and the extent to which those can be worked around or pushed to be relaxed.
@ferricoxide @luana No, it's a much different feature than the incomplete implementation for desktops. The entirely of the firmware and operating system are cryptographically verified with downgrade protection. The secure element is used to store the version metadata for downgrade protection for the OS and efuses are used for the firmware portion of it. It's fully integrated with the A/B update system with automatic rollback until reaching the home screen successfully.
@ferricoxide @luana It's the status quo on existing devices and has been one of the hardware requirements for GrapheneOS support for many years. Verified boot was introduced on the Nexus 5X and moved to an earlier version of the current approach with the Pixel 2. We've supported it since it was available and began considering it a requirement shortly afterwards. We only supported 2 generations of devices prior to it being available which could still be locked and had the firmware verification.
This is a premature joke for the 1. April, right? 😳🤔😂🤣
Choosing a company like Motorola with it's owner Lenovo behind it for the reasons of privacy and security isn't beyond a good idea but pure hypocrisy and a punch in the guts for all of the supporters of GrapheneOS in my opinion. 🖕
@kranzkrone GrapheneOS is a non-profit organization and no money is changing hands with Motorola. What do you think greed has to do with it? There's huge demand for us supporting an alternative to Pixels and we're doing that by working with an OEM. If you want to continue using Pixels then you can continue doing so. Google and Samsung are the only top 10 Android OEMs by sales which aren't Chinese-owned. We can't force Samsung to want to partner with us and the same applies to Sony too.
The point isn’t whether GrapheneOS receives money from Motorola.
The point is the consistency of the security and trust model you advocate! 🙄
GrapheneOS often emphasizes minimizing trust in large corporations, opaque supply chains, and potential state influence.
Yet Motorola is owned by Lenovo, a Chinese company operating under a legal environment where state access to companies can be mandated.
If the argument is that users should minimize trust and maximize verifiable security, partnering with an OEM embedded in that jurisdiction raises legitimate questions.
This isn’t about “greed” but about coherence of principles.
If Chinese OEM ownership is usually framed as a risk in privacy discussions, it seems inconsistent to dismiss those concerns when it becomes convenient for hardware support.
Criticism here isn’t hostility—it’s asking whether the same standards are being applied consistently. 😉
@kranzkrone It's quite apparent you're using an LLM to generate concern troll replies. It's incoherent and lacks actual substance. We're not going to be interacting with a text generator someone has directed to waste our time and energy.
If you don't want us banning your instance and making a public post asking everyone else to do the same then remove both of these AI generated replies and stop bothering us.
Here's our policy on AI generated content for discussions:
It's indeed quite apparent that you acting out in the same way like you did in the past when the founder of GrapheneOS had a personal dispute with another somewhat prominent personality of the tech world.
If you don't want me to further investigate your toxic behavior of communication and try to framing me as the bad one, you should definitely thread lightly.
Threatening me with whatever action won't result in deleting my previous posts but instead will strengthen my personal investment in further interactions and maybe legal actions.
Louis Rossmann may would find this interesting to read too.
@kranzkrone You've moved on from posting low quality concern trolling which appears to be at least partially generated by an LLM to blatant libel and support for harassment. We haven't framed you for anything. Your replies to our thread make it clear what you're doing.
Louis Rossmann orchestrated harassment towards our founder by making many extraordinarily dishonest claims in a video where he engaged in blatant bullying. Rossmann is openly a Kiwi Farms user and is the one who involved them.
@indigoamber It has to start with those because they'll be the first meeting our update and security feature requirements. Lower end devices can gradually be supported as the improved updates and security features trickle down to those.
If I may ask, as various sources say otherwise. Will there be one dedicated model with GrapheneOS out of the box, and will the rest of the models be hardware-ready for installing this system? Or is hardware support and manual installation the only option?
@lispi314 There's a *big* difference between "sloppy security that eventually gets pwned" and "deliberately backdoored by a nation-state for the purpose of domestic mass surveillance" @GrapheneOS @publicvoit @a53bdb @lunareclipse
@publicvoit @JamesDBartlett3 @lispi314 @a53bdb @lunareclipse People have different opinions. We're going to work with Motorola to meet all of our security requirements and improve security beyond that. They're helping us with providing GrapheneOS support for their devices rather than us having to do the work ourselves. They may end up contributing more to GrapheneOS beyond that too. In the future, we can work with other OEMs. It's not an exclusive partnership but we have limited resources.
@libresoftwarelover The phones will be available in Brazil at least to install the OS yourself. We aren't sure about the availability of devices with it preinstalled yet since it's very early and we don't know which barriers may come up for that and whether it could launch in some regions but not others.
since the bootloader will trust the grapheneos keys I can't imagine why would safetynet and the other play protect mechanisms won't pass attestation (for all intents and purposes graphene would be indistinguishable from the stock Motorola image)
if that's the case I'll buy the device the moment it comes out...
@dzervas It's not going to change anything about the Play Integrity API which would be an entirely different thing. It should be able to have a green boot state (not necessarily immediate at launch) but that doesn't mean that Google Play is going to allow it because we won't have an allowlisted build fingerprint.
@dzervas Potentially but it's not something we want to bring up right now rather than focusing on adding GrapheneOS support, meeting our hardware requirements and getting some additional security features implemented. The main way they could eventually help is getting app developers to add support for using GrapheneOS either by removing the Play Integrity API (idealy) or adding hardware-based attestation permitting GrapheneOS as a replacement or alternative to the Play Integrity API.
@NewDay14 @Cambion @a53bdb Motorola contacted us about working together and we enthusiastically pursued it. We would do the same if Samsung wanted to work with us. Our Motorola partnership is explicitly a non-exclusive contract. There would need to be another company wanting to work with us and capable of meeting our requirements for there to be another partnership though.
@Cambion @a53bdb Samsung is the best company when it comes to independence. Samsung produces their displays, batteries, cameras, and processors in South Korea mainly. If the goal is to minimize dependency on China and the US while still obtaining high-quality products, Samsung is the clear leader in that field. However, they are likely so large that they wouldn't be interested in a partnership.
@NewDay14 @a53bdb Many off the important parts are still made in China before it's shipped to other places the phones are made. There is no going around that. Beside, Vietnam is not much different when it comes to this...
@a53bdb To be fair, all phones are made there so that risk always exists anyway.
As long as GrapheneOS doesn't slack on their requirements including (but not limited to) being able to access low level stuff it shouldn't be much worse if you flash the phone yourself. And those kind of requirements are why Pixels where the only ones supported to begin with...
Will the 'ready for' (desktop mode) function work? This is a Motorola feature that I wouldn't want to lose after flashing the ROM. I once bought a Motorola specifically for this function.
@joonq @a53bdb Sorry, but despite US offices and staff, the company is 100% Chinese.
Here is why: -> Acquisition: Bought Motorola from Google in 2014 for $2.91B. -> Headquarters: Global HQ is in Beijing. -> Shareholders: Parent company Legend Holdings is Chinese. -> Leadership: CEO Yang Yuanqing is Chinese. -> Origins: Born from a state-owned research institute.
What might be cause for concern is if the ‘blond’ driving the world crazy were to target Motorola or Lenovo, causing them to pull out of the US market, or if, like Huawei, they were to have Android stripped away from them. At that point, they might decide on one of two things: either ‘steal’ the GrapheneOS technology, or strengthen their partnership with Graphene and make Graphene the primary software for Motorola/Lenovo. It could be an interesting development, but I imagine it would be stressful for the creators of Graphene
@FynnND Both iPhones and Pixels have official battery replacement kits available along with it being relatively straightforward for the most recent generations of each. You can already use GrapheneOS on a Pixel today.
Fairphones lack crucial standard privacy and security patches/protections. They're incredibly far from meeting our requirements. Fairphones aren't a serious option if you care about privacy and lack basic safety due to lack of kernel updates, etc.
thoughts on what Motorola was doing with the affiliate link injection or their TOS saying you can’t sell a phone you bought if you unlock the boot-loader and install a different OS?
This entry was edited (Thursday, May 28, 2026, 6:36 PM)
@top It wasn't authorized by them and appears to have been a supply chain attack from a company doing contracting work for them. It was quickly disabled via some kind of update
GrapheneOS won't be using any of their apps and services. GrapheneOS also won't be using their regular vendor code and vendor SELinux policy but rather a more stripped down version close to the standard Qualcomm SDK with the extra drivers, etc. needed on top of that added. It will have less nonsense than with Pixels.
This is very exciting news! As someone who is often outdoors in rough environment I would love it if support for GrapheneOS comes to the future models in the LEX line up that Motorola makes. GrapheneOS would certainly make sense for a mission critical LTE device that is advertised as a secure mobile platform. As someone who often uses devices in rough conditions I always thought that if it was running a OS that was secure and I could actually trust it would be the perfect device.
We're partnered with Motorola Mobility rather than Motorola Solutions. They're entirely separate companies since the split in 2011. Motorola Mobility was acquired by Google in 2012 and then sold to Lenovo inn 2014.
Motorola Mobility is the successor of the consumer hardware division while Motorola Solutions makes much more niche products focused on government contracts.
Motorola Mobility wants to get into the enterprise and government markets so they're focusing on improving security.
This entry was edited (Sunday, July 19, 2026, 11:56 PM)
Thank you for clarifying that for me! I am a bit disappointed that Motorola Mobility isn't the company that manufactures those devices but I am hopeful that with their new focus on security and attempt to get into the same sectors they may make a device that has the same goal and is similarly capable as the LEX and runs GrapheneOS. :D
"I was born in an Iranian prison. My parents were held in their jails. My uncles lie in their mass graves. Nothing you can tell me about the crimes of the Iranian regime that I haven’t lived in blood and bone. That doesn’t mean I want my people bombed, maimed, killed, their homes in ruins. If your vision of liberation comes only through the destruction of innocent lives, then it’s not freedom you’re after.”
"PK: We have both been anti-war voices (as well as anti-sanctions) and also voices of pro-Palestinian solidarity for ages now. Can you talk about what that means in this moment?
SD: I feel that this is happening now—that the war has come to Iran—because we didn’t fight hard enough for Gaza, for Palestine. We didn’t stand tall enough. We didn’t risk enough. And I include myself in that. I didn’t do enough. I didn’t speak loud enough against the utter injustice that is waged against the Palestinian people.
That silence—ours and the world’s—has emboldened Israel to act with total impunity. It struck Lebanon, Yemen, Syria. No one said anything. It actively starves people, kills them as they wait for food, and still the international community says nothing.
Never has it been clearer to me now: we the people of the MENA region are completely on our own. And we will not survive this hell unless we unite, unless we truly see and hear one another, unless we fight for each other. Not only against war but against e
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"PK: We have both been anti-war voices (as well as anti-sanctions) and also voices of pro-Palestinian solidarity for ages now. Can you talk about what that means in this moment?
SD: I feel that this is happening now—that the war has come to Iran—because we didn’t fight hard enough for Gaza, for Palestine. We didn’t stand tall enough. We didn’t risk enough. And I include myself in that. I didn’t do enough. I didn’t speak loud enough against the utter injustice that is waged against the Palestinian people.
That silence—ours and the world’s—has emboldened Israel to act with total impunity. It struck Lebanon, Yemen, Syria. No one said anything. It actively starves people, kills them as they wait for food, and still the international community says nothing.
Never has it been clearer to me now: we the people of the MENA region are completely on our own. And we will not survive this hell unless we unite, unless we truly see and hear one another, unless we fight for each other. Not only against war but against every last trace of fascist dictatorial rule that has brought ruin upon us and our lands. No one will bring us salvation. Only we can."
Of course, the right wing would cringe at the concept of freedom being real anyway. Their world only accepts a narrative that everyone is out for themselves, and that freedom is a lie told by those seeking only power for themselves. Which they do, every damn day.
This entry was edited (Sunday, March 1, 2026, 6:53 PM)
If there was any indication at all that Trump and Netanyahu were in this to help the Iranian people in any way, there could be a meaningful conversation about whether the means were justified or appropriate. But that is not why these men are in this fight.
He ticked off the box in front "war" to get more support at home.
At the same time he is arguing that the same war that is supposed to raise support for #Trumpregime is supposed to weaken support for the Iranian regime. While it might weaken it because of the couple of bombs it will almost certainly push all non strict opposition citizens into a more "patriotic" pro regime mood. America the Big Satan. Self introspection is not a core American value
Thank you Jean for becoming our new 5€ a month supporter tromsite.com/donate/ !!
And thank you to everyone who supports TROM financially. We do a lot of projects. We provide a Friendica instance and have over a thousand users, a Peertube instance with unlimited uploads, a Nextcloud instance providing 10GB of space for everyone and a full Office Suite...a custom Linux distribution, a documentaries-based website...
See our donation page how many things we do. And we will do more!
Instead of humans being tribal, religious lunatics, trade fanatics and war thirsty, they should by now have created a paradise on Earth. Understand their fantastic story and how we are all connected to the other creatures, to the Earth and the universe, in a purely scientific way.
To use our resources to provide for all. To send rockets to the outer space to explore instead to send them on Earth to kill more. To fight with diseases, not with each other.
To grow our minds. Be busy with being smart and curious.
Instead this species is a total shitshow. Bunch of tribes with rockets.
Today we join various other FOSS advocacy groups like @fsfe @fdroidorg @eff in addressing an open letter to Google about #keepandroidopen We need open ecosystems and the move to "sideload" software has set a bad paradigm for having control over our devices. You can read more about it here:
Today Software Freedom Conservancy joins many other organizations in signing an open letter to Google asking that Android continue to allow people to install what they want on their phones.
#Google will cut off independent developers to #Android if they do not register with Google first. This will kill independent platforms like @fdroidorg and severely impede FLOSS devs from creating apps for Android.
Do you really think a company that lick the boots of a fascist dictator will give a damn about this open letter, let alone the openness of its own products?
This entry was edited (Thursday, February 26, 2026, 9:33 AM)
@olivenolje It costs a missed opportunity to give more appropriate advice: stay away from google and use more private community forks of android that if I understand correctly will not be affected by googles papers please app ecosystem.
A strategy focusing on begging tech giants to not do the will of capital is basically lying to the public that there is a chance this can work.
In theory yes the open letter is a nice thing to have regardless of how google reacts because then we have something to point to how google is ignoring public opinion - but it needs to be presented with heavy caveats and we need to focus on getting average people out of googles grip so they don't hold this much power over us
Oh! We agree. That's what @plasmamobile is all about. However, realistically PlaMo is not ready for the general public yet, despite how hard we are working on it.
If we could get the sort of support regular Plasma has, the story would be VERY different. But PlaMo is still niche.
I hadn't heard until Plasma Mobile until now, I had only heard of the pinephone one. I am excited to hear more about the project development in the future!
@ambiguous_yelp @olivenolje @plasmamobile AFAIK the pinephone is the hardware (that can run plasma mobile or another interface) and plasma mobile is the software (that can run on the pinephone or on another device)
Very much both. Also finding more hardware support. In that respect, we must not forget about the great work the people at @postmarketOS are doing! They help us get PlaMo on to more phones, giving us more space in which to grow.
However, if we insist on using Android (forks), we're still impacted by Google's decisions. Sooner or later, these forks will be less and less of a valid option (cf. how google's changes to the Pixel 10 series were a pain for the Grapheneos team).
Even if this letter fails, we shouldn't simply stick our heads in sand and look away from these issues. As you mentioned, raising public awareness is critical. So is fighting against their control.
I expect hardware to become more locked down, this is what states and capital want. The best solution to that continues to be open source hardware and modular devices.
I believe this because open source hardware and modular devices create power at a grassroots level and invites tighter crackdowns from governments - but there is a political limit to how oppressive a regime can be and the more power we build for ourselves the more expensive it will be for them to stop us using unapproved apps which slows the whole oppressive system down
@Stem this letter is not only for Google, but also regulators etc. Especially the EU should be up in arms over a DMA violation here, but that's just my opinion man
Apple and Google, 2 choices for apps from where we sit, and both are partners in crime. END MONOPOLIES. Capitalism has become extortion when conglomerated.
Tear everything apart and build it from scratch, the entire system has been subverted to evil.
How does Plasma Mobile fit into this? I thought Plasma Mobile positions itself as an alternative to Android, so I'm wondering why we don't hear much about it.
It is 222 A.D. You are the transgender Empress Elagabalus, "call me not a man for I am a woman". Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 1776. You are "Public Universal Friend", a transmasculine nonbinary Quaker. Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 1906. You are Karl M. Baer, a trans man undergoing sex reassignment. Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 1930. You are Lili Elbe. Transitioning is new and experimental. (to be fair you did get a uterus transplant.)
It is 1966. You are in Compton's Cafeteria with a bunch of other trans people when the owners call the cops to throw you all out. You riot. Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 1969. You are Marsha "pay it no mind" Johnson. You are in a mob-run gay bar when the cops attack. You throw a brick. There is a bit of a scuffle. Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 2026. You are a transgender adult or child listening to the NYT and British Guardian claim this is the first generation anyone has tried transitioning in. Transitioning is new and experimental.
This entry was edited (Wednesday, February 25, 2026, 5:10 PM)
It is 3rd century AD, you are no defined gender and a deity who is worshipped. "Laevius says: Worshiping, then, the nurturing god Venus, whether she is male or female, just as the Moon is a nurturing goddess. In his Atthis Philochorus, too, states that she is the Moon and that men sacrifice to her in women's dress, women in men's, because she is held to be both male and female." (Macrobius (c. 400s AD), Saturnalia 3.8.2) Nothing is new. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aphrodit…
300 BC you reject gender norms to the point of castrating yourself with no anesthesia so you can become a galli and live like a woman. Transitioning is new and experimental
i did a relatively thorough media search and purported surprise at the existence of trans people crops up every eighteen months back to the invention of newspapers
@miriamrobern You can always rely on the news to tell us that nobody wants to work anymore, kids are more disrespectful than they used to be, and trans people are new and scary.
It is 1865. You are Doctor James Barry, stealth transgender man and former Inspector General for the British army. You leave notice that upon your death your body must not be examined. This is not followed, and a media circus follows with a shocking gender reveal. Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 1876. You are author Marc/Marie de Montifaud. You "crossdress" as a man when visiting the library for research, use the names Marc and Marie interchangably, and your pronouns are known by multiple people to be she/he. Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 1880. You are known mononymously as the decadent author Rachilde. You delight in presenting publicly as sometimes a man, sometimes a woman, sometimes in between. You joyfully describe yourself as "androgynous". Transitioning is new and experimental.
It is 7th century BCE. You are mythological third-gendered entity Asu-shu-namir, created by the god Enki to rescue Innana after the goddess descended into the underworld to steal her sister Ereshkigal's power. You are impossibly beautiful, neither man or woman, and your goal is to seduce the Queen of the Netherworld and steal the waters of life to revive Inanna. Upon completing your task you are caught, and while Inanna escapes, you do not. You and others like you are cursed by Ereshkigal to suffer economic hardship and social ostracization unto eternity. Transitioning is new(?) and experimental(?).
@Pamela1960 let's not forget that these devices could be very useful, maybe even life-changing for people with impaired sight, and possibly other disabilities too?
With the success of Meta's camera glasses, there is now a risk of being recorded without consent or knowledge and ending up exposed in a crude video on TikTok or Instagram.
@naturepunk I think if they can be picked out it’s a good thing, but theoretically they can load the same type of capture and recognition capabilities- so even though it should be obvious someone is using them, they could be disguised as something else if not worn by the user? Seems fine to keep detecting them.
Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.
that's great and all, but as a non-gender-conforming glasses wearer with social anxiety and somewhat visible autism, do you understand how much harder you're going to make it for me to exist in a city?
no, a weak-ass disclaimer at the bottom of a paragraph of text isn't sufficient. the vast - overwhelming, i'd suggest - majority of people wearing glasses are wearing entirely un-smart glasses that are necessary for them to see shit. and at least some of us are going to be harassed because of this app. "some of us" meaning disproportionately disadvantaged folk - who are of course the least likely to be able to afford smart glasses anyway, but by far the easiest people to approach and smash the entirely necessary prosthetic glasses of.
in short - go back to the drawing board, and don't be so fucking ableist and irresponsible in your next iteration.
This entry was edited (Tuesday, February 24, 2026, 5:38 PM)
@akamran @daltux @fdroidorg I really like #fdroid, but with the handy tool #Obtainium it's very easy to have all your open source apps installed and updated directly from public sources like github.
Today, the final negotiations on Chat Control 2.0 begin.
We hope the European Parliament stands firm against any wording that paves the way for mass surveillance and censorship. Cyprus, currently holding the Presidency of the Council of the EU, aims to conclude the negotiations by June.
A reminder of the corrupt backstory behind the Chat Control proposal and the involvement of Ashton Kutcher and his company Thorn: mullvad.net/why-privacy-matter…
After Snowden’s whistleblowing in 2013, large parts of the internet became encrypted, enabling private and secure communication. Not everyone has welcomed this change. Most notably, the FBI and other U.S.
Google state that from September, they will be non-consensually pushing an update to all #Android phones (70% of all phones) that irrevocably blocks you from running whichever software you choose on your phone.
#Apple's iOS is already worse, leaving nowhere to go.
For details, and simple steps to push for Android devices to remain open computing platforms, see:
This is why I will have a new android burner and the cheap tablet I currently own, each with apps of its own that I regularly use, I'll devide the apps.
@stateofresearch A good approach, but this is a threat that can't be addressed at the level of individual practice, only via this collective campaign.
Because if Google follow through on this, we will suddenly have no way to access any apps that aren't centrally authorised.
It will be the equivalent of Windows preventing you from running .exe files. Only software that Google authorise and approve (under government supervision) will run on our devices.
I am, in fact, my own worst enemy when it comes to PeerTube federation.
If you follow @techlore, your subscription may have been broken....perhaps permanently? Hard to know with federation. The counter resets on my end but that may not reflect actual subscriptions.
Can any of you all let me know if you are still getting notified for new content? Just published our newest video there.
Almost 40 orgs just signed an open letter telling Google to reverse Android Developer Verification, we're one of them.
Google has not backed down and seems to have no intention of keeping Android open. Check out our newest video covering what's going on and what we can do: youtu.be/5MZfGq5F1NU
Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.
instead of begging Google, or any big tech corp, those orgs should try to create & support an independent mobile OS, just like Linux for desktop, because this will keep happening again as we've seen in the past.
They now have Agent Orange and their CEOs are rulers from behind. Why anyone is expecting them to listen to the serfs being their commodity is beyond my comprehension.
Get rid of fascism, restore justice then they "voluntarily" start to please new masters and reluctantly will abide. Until then buy Chinese MT8xxx based phone where you can break into the MT cpu and implant your own OS (or better yet ditch G spybrick and start to use a phone + pi).
$0.02
This entry was edited (Thursday, February 26, 2026, 12:34 AM)
combining whats happening in u.s. politics and big tech corporate sector. it starts to be scary. i don't think alphabet inc is going to back down, it is about control and power and u.s. government is part of it.
for short term maybe: linux laptop. ungoogled android. basic technical phone. mobile linux distribution.
for long term. move away from android, it starts to be lost cause. apple's devices are lost causes as well.
The European Commission is pushing hard to extend Chat Control 1.0 - allowing mass scanning of private messages without court orders for another two years. Contact your MEPs TODAY via fightchatcontrol.eu/ to defend your privacy and digital rights!
Alt text: screenshot of web interface: The EU (still) wants to scan your private messages and photos The "Chat Control" proposal would legalise scanning of all private digital communications, including encrypted messages and photos. This threatens fundamental privacy rights and digital security for all EU citizens.
4 MEMBER STATES OPPOSING 23 MEMBER STATES SUPPORTING 0 MEMBER STATES UNDECIDED
MEP STANCES ON CHAT CONTROL 1.0 EXTENSION: 0 Opposing, 720 Unknown, 0 Supporting
hmm, first time seing this issue. But this is just on my instance, on your instance (fosstodon.org) it shows up fine. Mastodon web interface probably just can't embed the liliputing.com article properly or something.
But good thing that you used a #PocketBlue tag, so that we are able to search for it ourselves 👍
What I shared was a link to the actual post on Liliputing, but when I pasted in the URL it suddenly disappeared leaving behind what I thought was a link preview.
But now I see it's actually not a link preview but a quote post! So, the Liliputing *website* itself hooked up directly to #ActivityPub, is that how it works @liliputing? 😮
Not sure where #Google asked for feedback about their developer verification program, but they surely didn't talk with #FLOSS devs, civil society, privacy organisations or their #Android users
#FDroid did since September, and interacted with folks in the Fediverse, forum, email and in person
They all voiced one opinion: "developer verification must be stopped"
@marcprux has written an open letter, signed by likeminded organisations who want to #keepandroidopen
As we wrote about back in September in F-Droid and Google’s Developer Registration Decree, Google plans to enforce mandatory developer registration as a requ...
Right from the start I would look up an app and then find a place I could download the apk file and install it myself. All you have to do to is find the android setting that says, "install from other sources" and yer set.
Android app developers relying on google play services voluntarily over such a long time i would say have been complicit, that was the starting point to what we see now progressively less Open.
I hope that Google changes its mind, but as a shareholder company, they aren't a community. So I don't hold out too much hope.
But what I do hope is that AOSP eventually forks from Google, and other Open source mobile OS's start growing their market share away from Google. Its time for these options to go mainstream. We need F-Droid to be there for this.
Eventually we need an OpenAPK standard to build around that is not reliant on Google.
This entry was edited (Wednesday, February 25, 2026, 1:58 AM)
@adventure_tense Non-stock Android will continue to work just fine (well until Google locks-down AOSP), but suddenly 3.9 billion devices won't be able to install good apps.
- Also sign the petition at change.org. The more of us that speak out against it the better chance we have of getting Google to back down. c.org/kRnMMnS9LP
I completely agree with everything written by F-Droid, and I have signed the petition, but still this is the reminder for all developers why should prefer the only truly free platform for development of applications, which is the Internet itself, and #Webapp s . Yes, it is not fit for every application, but everywhere else you are #Sharecropper on your master’s plantation.
The world of Nostr isn't stressing out over this because we use the new Zapstore that allows developers to directly sign and release apps using the Nostr protocol.
F-Droid could release apps over the Nostr protocol, and offer their own Nostr appstore client, and bypass Google completely.
@firedragon It does not matter how the bits travelled through the ether.
Will #Zapstore bow down to #Google and become a registered dev? A registered store? If not... then 3.9 billion users can't install zapstore-1.0.0.apk. The end.
Meh .. Why talking to Google at all. I've started using the Zapstore app store being built by the Nostr community. Zapdtore is an app built around empowering developers to release and sign apps over the Nostr protocol without having to get permission from and app store or any other entity such as a tyrannical goveenment. They just released version 1.0 Zapstore.dev
/PS: Nice PR campaign to piggy-back on #keepandroidopen wave of support to promote #zapstore, too bad somebody did not grasp what is actually at stake.
🚨 Google wants to force every Android developer to register with them, even if you never touch the Play Store. We signed the open letter opposing this alongside EFF, Proton, F-Droid, Tor Project, and 30+ others. Android's openness is non-negotiable.
Auf YouTube findest du die angesagtesten Videos und Tracks. Außerdem kannst du eigene Inhalte hochladen und mit Freunden oder gleich der ganzen Welt teilen.
Some news and updates : 1 - The good news our videos will be published on Ecoflix - ecoflix.com/ It's kind of Netflix for nature and wildlife documentaries, most are about conservation and restoration. It's for free, and it's great. I won't get paid anything from them, as all of the profits are going to nature conservation projects it's a "no profit" platform. But maybe we will reach new people there. So I was buys preparing 10 episodes which will be season 1 from them
2 - At the end of March, me & Mara will be going to Brussels to perform a duo music performance with the sounds of the whales at the European Commission. There will be conference about Climate Change. And we will also speak about Oceans and Cetaceans. We also not getting paid for that, but
Some news and updates : 1 - The good news our videos will be published on Ecoflix - ecoflix.com/ It's kind of Netflix for nature and wildlife documentaries, most are about conservation and restoration. It's for free, and it's great. I won't get paid anything from them, as all of the profits are going to nature conservation projects it's a "no profit" platform. But maybe we will reach new people there. So I was buys preparing 10 episodes which will be season 1 from them
2 - At the end of March, me & Mara will be going to Brussels to perform a duo music performance with the sounds of the whales at the European Commission. There will be conference about Climate Change. And we will also speak about Oceans and Cetaceans. We also not getting paid for that, but at least our expenses are covered since Brussels is very expensive. We will also take Night Train from Vienna. Which I am very curious about.
3 - While I've been in January in Latvia I've managed to appear at 2 radio shows, had long interview at Delfi.lv - largest news platform in Latvia, and in 2 TV shows on Latvian TV. All of it is in Latvian language, so I won't share it here, just some pictures. But it was good coverage. In all of the interviews I spoke about nature protection and volunteering.
5 - Meanwhile I am looking for other project to join and volunteer. Probably in March it will be Moldavia, then there are probably will be something in Montenegro and Serbia.
So actually quite a lot of things going on even if I am not actively volunteered these month. But winter is like this, there are not many projects at this period. Everything starts in spring.
I was a bit depressed and discouraged for the couple of months, but I can't give up, somehow we all need to keep going and doing good things in life even if sometimes it seems impossible or feels like there is no point.
![A screenshot of an Android app. Text:
▲ Nearby Glasses
Smart Glasses are probably nearby
Device: Unknown
RSSI: -42 dBm
Reason: Meta Company ID (0x058E)
Company: Meta Platforms, Inc.
This app notifies you when smart glasses are nearby. It uses company identificators in the Bluetooth data sent out by these. Therefore, there likely are false positives (e.g. from VR headsets). Hence, please proceed with caution when approaching a person nearby wearing glasses. They might just be regular glasses, despite this app's warning.
Debug Log
[19:08:40] Unknown (-50 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:40] Unknown (-50 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:41] Unknown (-34 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:42] Unknown (-34 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:42] Unknown (-34 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:42] Unknown (-57 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:43] Unknown (-40 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:43] Unknown (-42 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
...](https://social.trom.tf/photo/preview/640/42287448 "A screenshot of an Android app. Text:
▲ Nearby Glasses
Smart Glasses are probably nearby
Device: Unknown
RSSI: -42 dBm
Reason: Meta Company ID (0x058E)
Company: Meta Platforms, Inc.
This app notifies you when smart glasses are nearby. It uses company identificators in the Bluetooth data sent out by these. Therefore, there likely are false positives (e.g. from VR headsets). Hence, please proceed with caution when approaching a person nearby wearing glasses. They might just be regular glasses, despite this app's warning.
Debug Log
[19:08:40] Unknown (-50 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:40] Unknown (-50 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:41] Unknown (-34 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:42] Unknown (-34 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:42] Unknown (-34 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:42] Unknown (-57 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:43] Unknown (-40 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
[19:08:43] Unknown (-42 dBm) Meta Company ID (0x058E)
...")
The Whore of Blahbylon
Unknown parent • • •RevPudDudley
in reply to The Whore of Blahbylon • • •something about Chaos being Averted